Author [NL] [FR] [ES] [DE] [SE] [IT] [NO] [MY] Topic: what adjustments have you made to your suspension  (Read 7642 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline 54K+

  • Crossrunner Pro
  • ***
  • Posts: 243
  • Bike: Caponord Rally
  • City / Town: Addlestone
  • Country: Surrey, UK
what adjustments have you made to your suspension
on: June 11, 2015, 04:39:09 PM
I know we pre 2015 owners are limited to rear pre-load and compression damping but (as noted elsewhere there are threads which discuss after market products). Not satisfied with the ride of my bikes front end, I am interested that other users find it "Spot On".

What do you weigh ( in full kit) and what sort of riding do you do?

Both questions need to be considered when giving an opinion.

I weigh in at 17st. kitted up (approx. 110 kgs) I ride gently but also, "like i stole it" on occasion ( hence the need for my desire to have adjustable forks.)

I find the front a little harsh when pottering and too much dive and chatter when pushing on.

What changes have you made to the suspension and why. Also has it made an improvement?

Trevor

Offline Si Click

  • Crossrunner Master
  • ****
  • Posts: 286
  • Bike: Honda VFR 800 X
  • Country: UK
Re: what adjustments have you made to your suspension
Reply #1 on: June 11, 2015, 06:49:22 PM
Fully kitted I weigh about 90 kilos, mostly commuting at enthusiastic motorway speeds with my fair share of filtering and urban crawling.  Still wearing the Pirelli Scorpions which I don't particularly trust, so I still have some chicken strips, but I'm not averse to pressing on.

I've made no changes to the front end, the rear I have altered by changing the geometry by lowering the rear and tweaking the pre-load to give the best compromise of handling and ride height.

The front end chatters over poor surfaces and is not inspiring at speed.  The back end seems OK for my purposes, but would not be ideal for a track day.

Given that I did not buy this as a sports bike, I am content with the rear for now, but will upgrade when the standard shock wears out ~ 20K. The front end I may well sort earlier if there is a good alternative.
Best Regards Dave
2011 Honda Crossrunner
1955 Triumph TR2
1999 Land Rover Discovery 2 TD5 ES

Offline rmurgelj

  • Crossrunner Member
  • **
  • Posts: 17
  • Bike: Crossrunner 800
  • City / Town: Ljubljana
  • Country: Slovenia
Re: what adjustments have you made to your suspension
Reply #2 on: June 15, 2015, 09:18:44 PM
HI Guys,

Regarding suspension on my 2013 VFR X: it is a crap...

I rode Yamaha FZ6, Kawsaki Z750, Yamaha XJR 1300, Honda Cbf 1000, Yamaha XJR 1300, and now Honda VFRX 800 - and like written, suspension is a crap. Do not want to expose my mileage...

First of all:

Forks:

- stock springs are progressive, but way to soft
- compression damping is to soft
- rebound damping it to stiff
- there is no adjustment ( in EU ) so I do not know what you will adjust ( when remowing plastics )
- riding potholes packs down suspension

Shock:
- compression damping is zero, and non adjustable
- rebound damping is fine as it can be adjusted ( and it can be adjusted fine )
- spring rate is fine for cca. 90 kg rider
- since there is no compression built in shock there is only option to ride the shock on 6 - 7 preload and rebound set up to road quality

Options:

Front:
- new springs and oil ( I changed to Wilbers progressive and it works fine, not optimum, but fine. Front tyre wear reduced significant )
- new cartidge; better improvement, more expensive and needs better user / tuner

Shock:
- only satisfying optinon is to change the shock ( I went modest way and I bought Wilbers 640 Road )

Regarding tyres, Pirelli Scorpions are very good tyres in dry and wet, second set I used were Dunlop Sportsmarts. Bad front tyre, slips on intermediate angle when changing tarmac surfaces.

Now I am on, wouldnt beleive. Mitas sport force +, excellent tyres, warm up cycle excellent, very stable at any lean angle, proven at serios lean angle, high mileage, best ever.

BR,

Rok


Offline 54K+

  • Crossrunner Pro
  • ***
  • Posts: 243
  • Bike: Caponord Rally
  • City / Town: Addlestone
  • Country: Surrey, UK
Re: what adjustments have you made to your suspension
Reply #3 on: June 15, 2015, 10:27:43 PM
interesting post thank you.  :028:

What did that little lot cost ??  :037:

keep us posted on your thoughts

Offline rmurgelj

  • Crossrunner Member
  • **
  • Posts: 17
  • Bike: Crossrunner 800
  • City / Town: Ljubljana
  • Country: Slovenia
Re: what adjustments have you made to your suspension
Reply #4 on: June 16, 2015, 07:40:42 AM
HI,

front fork springs with oil, instalation and discount - 110 eur.

rear shock, with instalation and discount - 420 eur.

Now this is totaly different bike.

Front forks rebound propely and never ever packs down. Wilbers progressive springs are stiffer, air camber is changed, giving enough compression damping to cope with rebound damping, not allowing forks to pack down.

Of course it would be better to buy Matris cartidge or rebuild the original cartidge ( Haslacher in Thalgau / Austria did it for me on couple of other bikes, changing damping settings and fitting proper springs, oil thickness and oil level ), but I decided to go this way to see what it brings and results are OK.
Good cartidge ( shock absorber ) then needs good tuner, most of road riders are not - good tuners - to understand each other, and then they spend most of the time turning knobs - instead enjoying, unfortunately making things worse.
Had that kind of experience when I was fresh in motorbiking.

Regarding shock, Wilbers Road 640, it is not top line  - it is not basic line ( top line is 641 - 643 ), basic line is 540.
640 Road, being emulsion shock, offering 22 clicks of rebound damping adjustement and stepless preload adjustment ( hydraulic optional ) is enough for road use.
Its minus is not offering compression adjustment, and when really pushing the bike hard it tends to let you down sooner, as it overheats. It does not have dislocated reservoir.

For road use, including very dynamic ride, this package is fine for everyone.

BR,

Rok

Offline Si Click

  • Crossrunner Master
  • ****
  • Posts: 286
  • Bike: Honda VFR 800 X
  • Country: UK
Re: what adjustments have you made to your suspension
Reply #5 on: June 16, 2015, 09:33:26 AM
A quick Google suggests 499 Euros for the WR 640 and 99 Euros for the WR progressive springs in the UK, all without postage or installation.

http://wilberssuspension.co.uk/index.php

Best Regards Dave
2011 Honda Crossrunner
1955 Triumph TR2
1999 Land Rover Discovery 2 TD5 ES

Offline 54K+

  • Crossrunner Pro
  • ***
  • Posts: 243
  • Bike: Caponord Rally
  • City / Town: Addlestone
  • Country: Surrey, UK
Re: what adjustments have you made to your suspension
Reply #6 on: June 16, 2015, 01:46:01 PM

Not sure the front changes are a good balance to the effort put into the rear here. To my mind the front need more desperate sorting.

Oh Dear now I want the rear doing as well as the front  :138:
Last Edit: June 16, 2015, 01:48:33 PM by 54K+

Offline rmurgelj

  • Crossrunner Member
  • **
  • Posts: 17
  • Bike: Crossrunner 800
  • City / Town: Ljubljana
  • Country: Slovenia
Re: what adjustments have you made to your suspension
Reply #7 on: June 16, 2015, 05:26:51 PM
Look,

shock is a crap, much bigger crap than forks. If you change the springs in forks, they will be about right.

But there is no sense in rebuilding rear shock. Only good thing on it is spring.

And at the end, of course, front end must be doing what rear end is doing.

Probably you do not see problem at the rear, because there is no damping in it. When there is no damping, it rides fine, but tends to wallow.

I tell you, for sport touring to sport riding use, there is only two seeting that works ( on Slovenian destroyed roads ): 6 groove - rebound 1,5 - 1,25 / 7 groove - rebound damping 1,25  -1.

Regarding quality of suspension, this is what Maxton is able to say ( copied form other forum on rc46 ):

Sent Maxton an email last night, and they responded by lunchtime today which I thought was pretty good. Thought I'd share their thoughts on the VFR800's (not VTEC) suspension :

FRONT
The forks work reasonably well for general road use but if you ride the bike hard or carry a pillion they need to be modified. The forks are underdamped and undersprung , we revalve and respring them fitting harder springs to suit your rider weight and also to suit what the bike is being used for, this gives the bike alot more feel in the corner and also alot more stability under heavy braking. The cost of the fork conversion is £215 plus VAT. Seals are £20 plus VAT for the pair and Bushes £20 plus VAT if required.

REAR
The rear unit is a Showa unit and is a unit which we can service but cannot buy any parts for. The spring on the unit is approximately about the right rate for the average weight of rider, the biggest problem with the unit is there's not enough travel in it, it only has 3" of wheel travel built into the shock absorber, all bikes should have 5" approxamatley. As there is not enough travel the shock will bottom out on the bumpstop causing the bike to launch you out of the seat. You will make the problem worse if you load the bike up with a pillion or luggage. Unfortunately there is nothing we can do to change the design of the unit which means we cannot stop this problem. We supply a Maxton replacement unit which is a fully adjustable, alloy bodied, high pressure gas unit that adjusts via shim stack system. The unit has a spring to suit your rider weight and to suit what type of riding you do. The unit costs £405.00 but we also make a remote reservoir unit that has a second compression adjuster which costs £475.00. ALL PRICES EXCLUDE V.A.T.

Remember, all other suspension tuner will say the same:
- spring about right for 90 kg rider
- travel / disaster
- no compression
- rebound ok

This tells you: set the shock incorrect to make it work at least close to correct.
Set it correct ( 30 - 35 mm SAG ), it does not work. It wallows ....
Close the rebound to stop wallowing - it packs down.
Increase the preload to gain compression and increase rebound - the best you can get, but you additionally limit travel.


Regarding prices of suspension, I have very good friend of mine, being Yamaha service partner. Good on prices for Wilbers - for his friends...

BR

Rok


Offline 54K+

  • Crossrunner Pro
  • ***
  • Posts: 243
  • Bike: Caponord Rally
  • City / Town: Addlestone
  • Country: Surrey, UK
Re: what adjustments have you made to your suspension
Reply #8 on: June 16, 2015, 08:53:30 PM
Thanks Rok
I get it!
Looks like I could be spending some money....

Trevor

Offline 54K+

  • Crossrunner Pro
  • ***
  • Posts: 243
  • Bike: Caponord Rally
  • City / Town: Addlestone
  • Country: Surrey, UK
Re: what adjustments have you made to your suspension
Reply #9 on: August 13, 2016, 07:20:16 AM
Still haven't made the suspension changes. I've serious considered the far replacement cartridge for the forks but would also have to change the handlebars to sw mochek risers to give access to the adjusters. I all seems like too much. For the gain I'll get, especially as i have slowed down a bit on the roads this year. :007: